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Barry N. Turner
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 Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:45 pm Post subject: Chainsaw Problems |
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I was going to saw out a few bowl blanks (for the first time) yesterday with
a borrowed chainsaw. I had a couple of 10" diameter pieces of fresh cut
maple that I had picked up from my friendly firewood dealer. Dang, that
chainsaw was dull!
After spending well over an hour sharpening and then resharpening the saw,
ripping the blanks apart still took a long, long time! I was afraid I was
going to run out of gas. I suspect the saw had been improperly sharpened,
(by its owner) maybe ruined.
Or, was it just because I was doing a ripping cut with a chain intended
primarily for crosscuts? I have used chainsaws many times before, but
always cross-cutting. If blanks are normally this hard to rip with a
chainsaw, I'm going to have to start looking for a bigger bandsaw real
soon. Any comments? Thanks.
Barry |
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AHilton
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| Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 6:00 pm Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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How were you ripping the log? With it standing on end? If so, then try
tipping it down straight in front of you and ripping at about a 45 degree
angle. It's still ripping but you're not hitting endgrain straight-on.
Having your chainsaw at the angle is also not putting your chain at a direct
parallel with the grain either. Having it at a direct parallel with the
grain will easily clog up most factory chainsaws too. It's a compromise.
How long of a bar did you have that it took you over an hour to sharpen it?
An actual ripping chain isn't necessary but for the most demanding of
ripping tasks (such as a mill). Ripping chains are terrible for normal
chainsawing tasks and are pretty dangerous at them too.
- Andrew
"Barry N. Turner" <barry712@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:gmTbc.5515$6D1.4227@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
| Quote: |
I was going to saw out a few bowl blanks (for the first time) yesterday
with
a borrowed chainsaw. I had a couple of 10" diameter pieces of fresh cut
maple that I had picked up from my friendly firewood dealer. Dang, that
chainsaw was dull!
After spending well over an hour sharpening and then resharpening the
saw,
ripping the blanks apart still took a long, long time! I was afraid I was
going to run out of gas. I suspect the saw had been improperly sharpened,
(by its owner) maybe ruined.
Or, was it just because I was doing a ripping cut with a chain intended
primarily for crosscuts? I have used chainsaws many times before, but
always cross-cutting. If blanks are normally this hard to rip with a
chainsaw, I'm going to have to start looking for a bigger bandsaw real
soon. Any comments? Thanks.
Barry
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Jamrelliot
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 6:01 pm Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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Hey Barry,
Logs are best cut at a 50 - 60 degree angle. Maybe this was the problem?
Hope to see you Tuesday night.
Jim |
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Ecnerwal
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 6:23 pm Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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In article <gmTbc.5515$6D1.4227@bignews5.bellsouth.net>,
"Barry N. Turner" <barry712@bellsouth.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
After spending well over an hour sharpening and then resharpening the saw,
ripping the blanks apart still took a long, long time! I was afraid I was
going to run out of gas. I suspect the saw had been improperly sharpened,
(by its owner) maybe ruined.
|
A chainsaw should not take an hour to sharpen, ever. And if it looks
like it will take that long with a file, don't. Spend the whopping $5
(that's the local price) to get it ground at a chainsaw shop, or ~$16 to
replace it with a new one. When the shop grinds it, they have a jig
which makes all the teeth the same length, etc, and it definitely comes
out of there cutting better than it does after 5 or 10 filings. I
suppose that someday it might be worthwhile to replicate their setup
(jig, special narrow wheel grinder), but for now it's easiest to keep a
couple of chains, and drop one off for grinding when needed.
You don't need ripping chain. It's dangerous stuff in a handheld saw,
and should be used only on mills, IMHO. YHO may vary.
A freshly ground crosscut chain rips just fine. The face comes out
nearly perfectly flat. It feeds itself. One that needs grinding wanders
all over the place and it an annoynace to try and control. It needs to
be pushed, and this is a clear sign that the chain needs to be swapped
out for a sharp one.
You can get away with crosscutting with a somewhat dull chain, but
ripping is much less forgiving.
--
Cats, Coffee, Chocolate...vices to live by |
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Brian Combs
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| Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 6:33 pm Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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The HF chainsaw sharpener works like a charm. Unfortunately the new ones
are all plastic. Still I saw one on sale the other day for $99. Have used
to sharpen my chains for the past three years and love it. I do a lot of
milling so go through some chains.
A sharp chain is the only way to go. The nice thing about having a proper
sharpener is that I don't wait until I am burning through the wood to
sharpen. I take it off as soon as I don't like the way it is cutting and
when I have four or five I sharpen them all at once.
Brian |
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Denis Marier
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 7:20 pm Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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I watched people cutting firewood for commercial purposes.
Truck load of 8 foot long logs are brought in. They are then cut it in
stove length with a chain saw and hydraulically splitted. The workers are
paid by the cord (4'X4'X8'lg).
They work all day. Cutting speed is of the essence. They stop to sharpen
their saw as need it and never allow it to become dull. They only use a
round file and eye balled the angle. I got to talk to them and asked as to
why they do not use a jig and fixture. They look at me and smiled. :-)
"Brian Combs" <bcombs@harbornet.com> wrote in message
news:2YGdnVhSBPZFge3d4p2dnA@harbornet.com...
| Quote: |
The HF chainsaw sharpener works like a charm. Unfortunately the new ones
are all plastic. Still I saw one on sale the other day for $99. Have
used
to sharpen my chains for the past three years and love it. I do a lot of
milling so go through some chains.
A sharp chain is the only way to go. The nice thing about having a proper
sharpener is that I don't wait until I am burning through the wood to
sharpen. I take it off as soon as I don't like the way it is cutting and
when I have four or five I sharpen them all at once.
Brian
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George
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 8:30 pm Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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They also remember to file their depth gages, which, we can hope, Barry
knows about. Most piece-cutters hereabouts actually take them down to the
link, which makes it more remarkable I haven't had more than two traumatic
amputations in 25 years.
Anyway, pictures being worth a few more pieces of bandwidth, and having
already posted a Sweetmunch-length post today, check
http://www.enter.net/~ultradad/ He may not have a Kubota, but he does logs
same as I.
Skip chains self-clean real well. Ripping chains are for chainsaw mills
cutting end, not skew to grain.
"Denis Marier" <marierdj@nb.sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:iJVbc.9880$Np3.329636@ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca...
| Quote: |
I watched people cutting firewood for commercial purposes.
Truck load of 8 foot long logs are brought in. They are then cut it in
stove length with a chain saw and hydraulically splitted. The workers are
paid by the cord (4'X4'X8'lg).
They work all day. Cutting speed is of the essence. They stop to sharpen
their saw as need it and never allow it to become dull. They only use a
round file and eye balled the angle. |
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Barry N. Turner
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 1:16 am Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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I thought an hour was pretty fast! It included tying to use a worn out
file, then a trip to "Homestead" for a grinding point for my Dremel tool!
It was just a standard 16: bar. I was going at the log at an angle from the
side, not ripping from the end.
Barry
"AHilton" <ahilton30@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:IPadnedHLtpwie3dRVn-iQ@centurytel.net...
| Quote: |
How were you ripping the log? With it standing on end? If so, then try
tipping it down straight in front of you and ripping at about a 45
degree
angle. It's still ripping but you're not hitting endgrain straight-on.
Having your chainsaw at the angle is also not putting your chain at a
direct
parallel with the grain either. Having it at a direct parallel with the
grain will easily clog up most factory chainsaws too. It's a
compromise.
How long of a bar did you have that it took you over an hour to sharpen
it?
An actual ripping chain isn't necessary but for the most demanding of
ripping tasks (such as a mill). Ripping chains are terrible for normal
chainsawing tasks and are pretty dangerous at them too.
- Andrew
"Barry N. Turner" <barry712@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:gmTbc.5515$6D1.4227@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
I was going to saw out a few bowl blanks (for the first time)
yesterday
with
a borrowed chainsaw. I had a couple of 10" diameter pieces of fresh
cut
maple that I had picked up from my friendly firewood dealer. Dang,
that
chainsaw was dull!
After spending well over an hour sharpening and then resharpening the
saw,
ripping the blanks apart still took a long, long time! I was afraid I
was
going to run out of gas. I suspect the saw had been improperly
sharpened,
(by its owner) maybe ruined.
Or, was it just because I was doing a ripping cut with a chain
intended
primarily for crosscuts? I have used chainsaws many times before, but
always cross-cutting. If blanks are normally this hard to rip with a
chainsaw, I'm going to have to start looking for a bigger bandsaw
real
soon. Any comments? Thanks.
Barry
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Barry N. Turner
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 1:26 am Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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Now, I know about depth guages. Wish I had know about them yesterday. I
told you guys I was a newby. Thanks. Barry
"George" <george@least> wrote in message
news:407037a8_3@newspeer2.tds.net...
| Quote: |
They also remember to file their depth gages, which, we can hope, Barry
knows about. Most piece-cutters hereabouts actually take them down to
the
link, which makes it more remarkable I haven't had more than two
traumatic
amputations in 25 years.
Anyway, pictures being worth a few more pieces of bandwidth, and having
already posted a Sweetmunch-length post today, check
http://www.enter.net/~ultradad/ He may not have a Kubota, but he does
logs
same as I.
Skip chains self-clean real well. Ripping chains are for chainsaw mills
cutting end, not skew to grain.
"Denis Marier" <marierdj@nb.sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:iJVbc.9880$Np3.329636@ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca...
I watched people cutting firewood for commercial purposes.
Truck load of 8 foot long logs are brought in. They are then cut it
in
stove length with a chain saw and hydraulically splitted. The workers
are
paid by the cord (4'X4'X8'lg).
They work all day. Cutting speed is of the essence. They stop to
sharpen
their saw as need it and never allow it to become dull. They only use
a
round file and eye balled the angle.
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AHilton
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 1:46 am Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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Ahhh, ok. So it wasn't an hour of grinding then. <g> If I'm taking more
than 10 minutes to sharpen one of the 24" trimming saws, I'm doing something
wrong or I got into some rocks, wire or fierce bugs. Grind just till it's
sharp. It doesn't take much more than a couple of strokes if you've got a
good file.
How do you like the Dremel sharpening? I like it myself. My Dad can't
stand it. He says that it takes off too much metal. I tell him you just
use it until the teeth are sharp and not just to play with it! <G> I
especially like the diamond coated wheels you can get for it to grind the
depth setters down on the safety chains. The main problem with the cordless
Dremels is that it will only do for about a couple of hours of sawing in the
field and there just only so many extra batteries you can carry.
- Andrew
"Barry N. Turner" <barry712@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:mV_bc.20235$tT3.3557@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
| Quote: |
I thought an hour was pretty fast! It included tying to use a worn out
file, then a trip to "Homestead" for a grinding point for my Dremel tool!
It was just a standard 16: bar. I was going at the log at an angle from
the
side, not ripping from the end.
Barry |
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Barry N. Turner
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 5:50 am Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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No, no, just a few minutes. But remember, everything takes a lot longer
when you don't know what you are doing. Actually, I tried my old file and
when it wouldn't cut, I went to the hardware for a new one. When the new
one wasn't much better, (man, those cutters were hard!)I went back to the
hardware store for a grinding point for my Dremel.
I have sharpened chainsaws before, but never encountered a chain made from
steel this hard. Or, maybe I just never encountered a chain so badly in
need of sharpening! This saw may be in need of a new chain, but the saw is
a borrowed one. Actually, the Dremel works pretty well. Mine's a corded
model, so I don't have to worry about batteries. Thanks for the help.
Barry
"AHilton" <ahilton30@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:N4mdnT4xC9CBH-3dRVn-hg@centurytel.net...
| Quote: |
Ahhh, ok. So it wasn't an hour of grinding then. <g> If I'm taking
more
than 10 minutes to sharpen one of the 24" trimming saws, I'm doing
something
wrong or I got into some rocks, wire or fierce bugs. Grind just till
it's
sharp. It doesn't take much more than a couple of strokes if you've got
a
good file.
How do you like the Dremel sharpening? I like it myself. My Dad can't
stand it. He says that it takes off too much metal. I tell him you
just
use it until the teeth are sharp and not just to play with it! <G> I
especially like the diamond coated wheels you can get for it to grind
the
depth setters down on the safety chains. The main problem with the
cordless
Dremels is that it will only do for about a couple of hours of sawing in
the
field and there just only so many extra batteries you can carry.
- Andrew
"Barry N. Turner" <barry712@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:mV_bc.20235$tT3.3557@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
I thought an hour was pretty fast! It included tying to use a worn
out
file, then a trip to "Homestead" for a grinding point for my Dremel
tool!
It was just a standard 16: bar. I was going at the log at an angle
from
the
side, not ripping from the end.
Barry
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Leo Lichtman
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 8:06 am Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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"AHilton" wrote: (clip) The main problem with the cordless Dremels is
that it will only do for about a couple of hours of sawing in the field and
there just only so many extra batteries you can carry.
^^^^^^^^^^^
I have a chainsaw sharpener that is sort of like a Dremel, but it is Oregon
brand. It is designed to run off a car battery, which eliminates the
recharging or spare battery problem. I can't imagine being very far from a
motor vehicle when using a chainsaw. The sharpener works great, and my
local chairsaw shop guy tells me it is actually better than his bench
grinder. I think that's because it removes less of the tooth per
sharpening. |
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AHilton
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2004 4:27 pm Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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The fellow in Idaho that makes a couple of my saws has one of those. I've
not tried it but he says that he really likes it out in the field.
Unfortunately, I'm often in places where I am away from a vehicle and have
to use the mules or winches. I assume the device plugs into a cig lighter
plug? I guess I could always just haul a battery to a central location and
use it from there though.
- Andrew
"Leo Lichtman" <l.lichtman@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:5X4cc.37268$He5.719955@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
| Quote: |
"AHilton" wrote: (clip) The main problem with the cordless Dremels is
that it will only do for about a couple of hours of sawing in the field
and
there just only so many extra batteries you can carry.
^^^^^^^^^^^
I have a chainsaw sharpener that is sort of like a Dremel, but it is
Oregon
brand. It is designed to run off a car battery, which eliminates the
recharging or spare battery problem. I can't imagine being very far from
a
motor vehicle when using a chainsaw. The sharpener works great, and my
local chairsaw shop guy tells me it is actually better than his bench
grinder. I think that's because it removes less of the tooth per
sharpening. |
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Rich Coers
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Apr 06, 2004 5:36 am Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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You might have to file down the rakers. The safety style chains run them
fairly close to the height of the tooth to limit the size of the chip. After
a few sharpenings the raker will be too high. I keep mine down about .03"
from the top of the tooth. That might be a little deep for a low horsepower
saw, but works great on my .029 Stihl.
Rich
"Barry N. Turner" <barry712@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:gmTbc.5515$6D1.4227@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
| Quote: |
I was going to saw out a few bowl blanks (for the first time) yesterday
with
a borrowed chainsaw. I had a couple of 10" diameter pieces of fresh cut
maple that I had picked up from my friendly firewood dealer. Dang, that
chainsaw was dull!
After spending well over an hour sharpening and then resharpening the
saw,
ripping the blanks apart still took a long, long time! I was afraid I was
going to run out of gas. I suspect the saw had been improperly sharpened,
(by its owner) maybe ruined.
Or, was it just because I was doing a ripping cut with a chain intended
primarily for crosscuts? I have used chainsaws many times before, but
always cross-cutting. If blanks are normally this hard to rip with a
chainsaw, I'm going to have to start looking for a bigger bandsaw real
soon. Any comments? Thanks.
Barry
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Denis Marier
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Apr 06, 2004 6:33 am Post subject: Re: Chainsaw Problems |
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I was having problems. I contacted Oregon. They sent me free of charge a
"Maintenance & Safety Manual for Saw Chain, Guide Bar, and Drive Sprocket."
Along with hands on experience I use this manual as the bible for saw chain.
Ex; by changing the angle on a regular saw you can make a ripping saw chain.
The book is pocket size with 90 pages. FWIW
"Rich Coers" <coers@ameritech.net> wrote in message
news:dQncc.3234$5d4.1408@newssvr31.news.prodigy.com...
| Quote: |
You might have to file down the rakers. The safety style chains run them
fairly close to the height of the tooth to limit the size of the chip.
After
a few sharpenings the raker will be too high. I keep mine down about .03"
from the top of the tooth. That might be a little deep for a low
horsepower
saw, but works great on my .029 Stihl.
Rich
"Barry N. Turner" <barry712@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:gmTbc.5515$6D1.4227@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
I was going to saw out a few bowl blanks (for the first time) yesterday
with
a borrowed chainsaw. I had a couple of 10" diameter pieces of fresh cut
maple that I had picked up from my friendly firewood dealer. Dang, that
chainsaw was dull!
After spending well over an hour sharpening and then resharpening the
saw,
ripping the blanks apart still took a long, long time! I was afraid I
was
going to run out of gas. I suspect the saw had been improperly
sharpened,
(by its owner) maybe ruined.
Or, was it just because I was doing a ripping cut with a chain intended
primarily for crosscuts? I have used chainsaws many times before, but
always cross-cutting. If blanks are normally this hard to rip with a
chainsaw, I'm going to have to start looking for a bigger bandsaw real
soon. Any comments? Thanks.
Barry
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